TM Debate Contest II - Netraa vs Maan

[Don]

[SHADOW="1"]Topic: WikiLeaks is good for Civilians

Netra: have to go for the topic ( Wikileaks is good for civilians )
Maan: have to against the topic ( wikileaks is NOT good for civilians )

Introduction:

WIKILEAKS ek aysi website hai jo anonymously sensitive, private and confidential data logo tak pohchati hai.

HINTS and TIPS for both contestants:

• Wikileaks is good for civilians
  • Civilians will know what their government are hiding from them.
  • they will know who is responsible for what.
  • professional like writer and genroulist will get good topics to write about.
• Wikileaks is NOT good for civilians:
  • they will have bad impact on their government
  • they will know what they should not need to know.
  • wikileak can disrespect their country publicly

Please, remember and follow DEBATE RULES


This Topic Will Close in 12 days ( December 17th 2010 )[/SHADOW]

 

[Netraa]

Thanks Don, Well i will try to always be for the Motion - That is 'WikiLeaks is good for civilians' eventhough as we all know every disputed subject has it's pros and cons.

Here is my first statement...

Some times we want to know the closed box, that says it has a fresh orange, and we all believed -- is actually having a rotten one! Wikileaks leaks the truth and shows the reality of diplomacy to the world.

 

[Don]

24 hours have been past, and Maan was unable to answer. therefor, Netra is the winner of this debate, and this thread is now closed. Unless both netra and maan are agreed to continue this thread.

 

[*Maan*]

Thanks Don, Well i will try to always be for the Motion - That is 'WikiLeaks is good for civilians' eventhough as we all know every disputed subject has it's pros and cons.

Here is my first statement...

Some times we want to know the closed box, that says it has a fresh orange, and we all believed -- is actually having a rotten one! Wikileaks leaks the truth and shows the reality of diplomacy to the world.

Assalaam-O-Alaikum Warehmatullahi Wabarakatuhu…

Mera topic hay “Wikileaks is NOT good for civilians”.

Reply of 1st statement of Netraa:

First of all I would like to say that why do we want to know the closed box of others… if we want to know the closed box of corrupt politicians so it can be ok BUT if we want to know about the box of other people so it CAN NOT be ok with any one. We are not allowed to know the confidential and sensitive data of others u know why because if you think that u r becoming aware by such data so its ok with u but actually it is NOT ok with those people who can be harmful for us for others and for Govt. as well.

U think Wikileaks shows the reality ok BUT what about that reality which should not be shown in front of such people u can take its negative benefit for their own sake???
For Example: Wikileaks leaks the confidential data of Govt. planning for the growth of our Country’s Economical Status and this act of wikileaks becomes the cause of failure of Govt. planning regarding Country’s Economics so how can any one say that wikileaks did anything good in it???
In above example Wikileaks simply became a cause of failure of a country’s economical enhancement.

Thank You.

 

[*Maan*]

Point from me:

Jesa k Don ne intro. me bataya hay k “WIKILEAKS ek aysi website hai jo anonymously sensitive, private and confidential data logo tak pohchati hai” to isi intro. se ye baat waazeh hay k jo website kisi ka sensitive/private aur confidential data logon tak pohonchati hay wo simply ghalat kar rahi hay.

Ø We all know that the terrorists and such people who are involved in terrorism they are always ready to get the CONFIDENTIAL/PRIVATE AND SENSITIVE data and information, when wikileaks discloses such information and data so obviously the terrorists get that data and info. and they use it for planning the destructive activities and at the end who people r in loss CIVILIANS. Yahan ye baat to barhi clear nazar aati hay k wikileaks kahin se bhi civilians k liye achi nahi hay.

Netraa please give me the answers of below questions in the regard of our topic:

• When your privacy goes out towards people via WIKILEAKS so will it be good for u???

• When any company’s confidential data comes out (unnecessarily) in front of business market should that company appreciate wikileaks for this?

• Suppose u r running a Govt. department and wikileaks reveals ur all confidential data while u want to keep it hide, so will u think that Wikileaks did good with u?

Yaqinan apke pas koi appropriate jawab nahi hoga kiun k kahin se bhi wikileaks Civilians k liye achi nahi hay.

 

[Netraa]

Maan Please find my answers.

Point from me:

Jesa k Don ne intro. me bataya hay k “WIKILEAKS ek aysi website hai jo anonymously sensitive, private and confidential data logo tak pohchati hai” to isi intro. se ye baat waazeh hay k jo website kisi ka sensitive/private aur confidential data logon tak pohonchati hay wo simply ghalat kar rahi hay.

Ø We all know that the terrorists and such people who are involved in terrorism they are always ready to get the CONFIDENTIAL/PRIVATE AND SENSITIVE data and information, when wikileaks discloses such information and data so obviously the terrorists get that data and info. and they use it for planning the destructive activities and at the end who people r in loss CIVILIANS. Yahan ye baat to barhi clear nazar aati hay k wikileaks kahin se bhi civilians k liye achi nahi hay.

Netraa please give me the answers of below questions in the regard of our topic:

• When your privacy goes out towards people via WIKILEAKS so will it be good for u???

• When any company’s confidential data comes out (unnecessarily) in front of business market should that company appreciate wikileaks for this?

• Suppose u r running a Govt. department and wikileaks reveals ur all confidential data while u want to keep it hide, so will u think that Wikileaks did good with u?

Yaqinan apke pas koi appropriate jawab nahi hoga kiun k kahin se bhi wikileaks Civilians k liye achi nahi hay.

1) Yes we all know that the terrorists want to sneak.

Do you know how many shocking news from terrorists or extrimists wikileaks has flashed, that these extrimists or bad people are planning to do in near future? Many!. Tell me how many news are there that has revealed the protection details that will help bad people? None.

After wikileaks has flashed the shocking news, now only everyone is alert about the lives of concerned persons. Do you think it is not helpful?? With this also civillians know about the real picture of terrorism.

2) Maan, Wikileaks does not leak anything about personal life. It does not leak the question papers before the exams. It does not reveals which civillian has voted which political party. It reveals the secrets about diplomats.

There is nothing to do with revealing personal secrets.

3) Same answer for company example. It is not related to diplomacy.

4) OK, Suppose there is a Govt. And you are right it does not want to reveal its secrets. Now when wikileaks leaks its secrets do you know what does it mean to civillian?

a) The Govt is so worthless they do not even know how to protect the secrets?!? Does these govt diplomats have any right to take any decision when they dont know how to keep those policies safe???

b) Sometimes civillian wants to know that what their govt says so sweet words to them but does not do in action! You should know that, I and every civillian will be glad if wikileaks leaks the policy that killed thousands of farmers by not giving funds to cultivation but putting money in their own pocket? There are so many examples are there for many govts.

Dont you want that civillian sometimes should atleast deserve to know what is rotten reality?

OR​

You want the govt will keep the corruption secret in the name of diplomacy and "keep sucking civillian's blood" ???

And yes, you said right, wikileaks did not good to Govt, because it has shown its ugly face, but definitely did a good job for civillian and thats what our topic.

Assalaam-O-Alaikum Warehmatullahi Wabarakatuhu…

Mera topic hay “Wikileaks is NOT good for civilians”.

Reply of 1st statement of Netraa:

First of all I would like to say that why do we want to know the closed box of others… if we want to know the closed box of corrupt politicians so it can be ok BUT if we want to know about the box of other people so it CAN NOT be ok with any one. We are not allowed to know the confidential and sensitive data of others u know why because if you think that u r becoming aware by such data so its ok with u but actually it is NOT ok with those people who can be harmful for us for others and for Govt. as well.

U think Wikileaks shows the reality ok BUT what about that reality which should not be shown in front of such people u can take its negative benefit for their own sake???
For Example: Wikileaks leaks the confidential data of Govt. planning for the growth of our Country’s Economical Status and this act of wikileaks becomes the cause of failure of Govt. planning regarding Country’s Economics so how can any one say that wikileaks did anything good in it???
In above example Wikileaks simply became a cause of failure of a country’s economical enhancement.

Thank You.

5) Yes you are right, any govt may not want to share secrets to others. But you know what is secret and what is not?

When Obama comes to India and gets bagfull of job back home US, everyone will know that, That is also diplomacy but not a secret.
But, when abc country wants to kick xyz country's back with the help of 123 country. That is secret because it is evil!

And yes if someone else knows that it is bad for the politicians, but good for normal civillians who can atleast choose a wise king for them next time!

I guess i have answered every letter of your every word of your every sentence. Sorry about your anticipation of not having any anwser from my side.

Thank you.

 

[*Maan*]

Netraa you are looking only one aspect of this topic…

Wikileaks shows the hidden activities of Govt. n all that, it’s ok but no one (including wikileaks) should show the confidential information and data which can be the cause of helping such people who tend to do destructive activities for a country or for a nation, they simply get benefit from this

WikiLeaks is presenting material to the world in the name of justice, but they do not see the big picture what is the actual thing going on and people (Civilians) have to get what wikileaks is spreading so here civilians are in lose.

The fact that they are leaking things while we are at war is sickening. They are putting the country's safety at risk.

Whatever wikileaks is showing to people this can ruin the co-operation between countries.

Wikileaks may not be making bombs, but the result of its activities could be even more lethal.

Thank You.​

 

[Netraa]

Netraa you are looking only one aspect of this topic…

Wikileaks shows the hidden activities of Govt. n all that, it’s ok but no one (including wikileaks) should show the confidential information and data which can be the cause of helping such people who tend to do destructive activities for a country or for a nation, they simply get benefit from this

WikiLeaks is presenting material to the world in the name of justice, but they do not see the big picture what is the actual thing going on and people (Civilians) have to get what wikileaks is spreading so here civilians are in lose.

The fact that they are leaking things while we are at war is sickening. They are putting the country's safety at risk.

Whatever wikileaks is showing to people this can ruin the co-operation between countries.

Wikileaks may not be making bombs, but the result of its activities could be even more lethal.

Thank You.​

1) No i am not looking at one aspect. There are so many points in my above post which are still un-answered. And yes i am supporting only positive side of this topic, since it is a debate.

2) We already discussed. I explained and gave examples too.

3) Among all of your points i honestly agree only on this point to some extent. Yes you right, sometimes wikileaks is not able to bring the big picture of the whole. It is giving only a part that might be mis guiding to civillian to understand whole picture.

But to answer this, i would say, even if it is part...it is a piece of truth. And if that part is indicating a killing or destroying plan that is good enough to understand whole picture. Isnt it. Actually wikileaks is trying to disclose those parts which have ugly intentions in it. And that is enough to understand.

4) No they are not triggering any war but they are trying to stop wars by leaking war plans.

5) If there is secret conspiracy between two countries. It has to ruin.

6) Lets say you are walking on a road. And some one is planning to put a bomb on your way. And wikileaks leaks it. Is it lethal?

All i am saying is, if something is truth, there is no harm knowing it. You can make a precautionary step with it.

 

[*Maan*]

Netraa please have a glance on my answers:

No i am not looking at one aspect. There are so many points in my above post which are still un-answered. And yes i am supporting only positive side of this topic, since it is a debate.

Every matter has two aspects one is positive and another is negative if u consider positive aspect as a whole matter it wouldn’t be the done thing. The other one (negative) aspect must be looked then u can come to know to whole matter only one aspect is not the whole matter.

Among all of your points i honestly agree only on this point to some extent. Yes you right, sometimes wikileaks is not able to bring the big picture of the whole. It is giving only a part that might be mis guiding to civillian to understand whole picture.

But to answer this, i would say, even if it is part...it is a piece of truth. And if that part is indicating a killing or destroying plan that is good enough to understand whole picture. Isnt it. Actually wikileaks is trying to disclose those parts which have ugly intentions in it. And that is enough to understand.


You agree that wikileaks is becoming a reason to misguide civilians so what is left? If civilians are not aware by the actual thing or by whole picture of the matter so they must be misguided and it is quite not the done thing for civilians.


When wikileaks spread a part of any matter so it could be the way of misguiding people. Wikileaks can simply give a (wrong or negative) way to civilians to think as wikileaks needs. It is not the whole thing that wikileaks provides 100% truth to us.

No they are not triggering any war but they are trying to stop wars by leaking war plans.


If they can leak war plan on one side so they can also leak the confidential data of a country which can be harmful for a country due to any other enemy country and if country is in lose by this so obviously CIVILIANS are also, as this is a point of our debate.

If there is secret conspiracy between two countries. It has to ruin.


Having a conspiracy between two Govt. can not fill the mind of their civilians against any other country until they flash any notes regarding this (which they don’t) BUT wikileaks does it, it spreads negative points (don’t know true or false) against political people, govt. etc which is cause of changing the mind of Civilians UNNECESSARILY.

Lets say you are walking on a road. And some one is planning to put a bomb on your way. And wikileaks leaks it. Is it lethal?


When wikileaks reveals the secret of any bomb planning it is considered as a + point of wikileaks very quickly but when wikileaks flashes the confidential information which should have been hidden so what about this???

I hope u will try to consider my point also.

 

[Netraa]

Netraa please have a glance on my answers:

No i am not looking at one aspect. There are so many points in my above post which are still un-answered. And yes i am supporting only positive side of this topic, since it is a debate.

Every matter has two aspects one is positive and another is negative if u consider positive aspect as a whole matter it wouldn’t be the done thing. The other one (negative) aspect must be looked then u can come to know to whole matter only one aspect is not the whole matter.

Among all of your points i honestly agree only on this point to some extent. Yes you right, sometimes wikileaks is not able to bring the big picture of the whole. It is giving only a part that might be mis guiding to civillian to understand whole picture.

But to answer this, i would say, even if it is part...it is a piece of truth. And if that part is indicating a killing or destroying plan that is good enough to understand whole picture. Isnt it. Actually wikileaks is trying to disclose those parts which have ugly intentions in it. And that is enough to understand.


You agree that wikileaks is becoming a reason to misguide civilians so what is left? If civilians are not aware by the actual thing or by whole picture of the matter so they must be misguided and it is quite not the done thing for civilians.


When wikileaks spread a part of any matter so it could be the way of misguiding people. Wikileaks can simply give a (wrong or negative) way to civilians to think as wikileaks needs. It is not the whole thing that wikileaks provides 100% truth to us.

No they are not triggering any war but they are trying to stop wars by leaking war plans.


If they can leak war plan on one side so they can also leak the confidential data of a country which can be harmful for a country due to any other enemy country and if country is in lose by this so obviously CIVILIANS are also, as this is a point of our debate.

If there is secret conspiracy between two countries. It has to ruin.


Having a conspiracy between two Govt. can not fill the mind of their civilians against any other country until they flash any notes regarding this (which they don’t) BUT wikileaks does it, it spreads negative points (don’t know true or false) against political people, govt. etc which is cause of changing the mind of Civilians UNNECESSARILY.

Lets say you are walking on a road. And some one is planning to put a bomb on your way. And wikileaks leaks it. Is it lethal?


When wikileaks reveals the secret of any bomb planning it is considered as a + point of wikileaks very quickly but when wikileaks flashes the confidential information which should have been hidden so what about this???

I hope u will try to consider my point also.

1. As it is a debate. We both have to support our own side.

2. This is a repeating point. As i said it is not misleading if the part of the truth is showing any evil intention.

3. You mean war is better than no war for civillian? If someone leaks war plan and stops war, it is bad?

4. There should not be any conspiracy between two countries. They should be friendly. If there is conspiracy it should be flashed in public to show how bad these politicians are. Wikileaks does the job.

5. Lets say you got a confidential information of others. and it says something destructive. Should you keep the information back in closed box?

We are repeating on points. And yes we have discussed so many points in this debate, that is good! Still if you have questions on my points please ask.

1) Another good point about wikileaks is, it is increasing political awareness in civillians, which is very good thing. Some basic knowledge about diplomacy or political over view every civillian should have before casting a vote.

2) Wikileaks will help civillians to decide whom they should vote and whom not.

Thank you.

 

[*Maan*]

1. As it is a debate. We both have to support our own side.

Off course we have to support our own side.

2. This is a repeating point. As i said it is not misleading if the part of the truth is showing any evil intention.

Dear Netraa, when wikileaks spreads any negative issue between the civilians and as we all don't know either it is truth of not so people have to make their mind as wikileaks wants their mind to run.

3. You mean war is better than no war for civillian? If someone leaks war plan and stops war, it is bad?

U r looking when they leak any war plan but u r not looking when they r making confusions by means of showing confidential documents etc while people have to assume it true but actually we r not confirm about it.

4. There should not be any conspiracy between two countries. They should be friendly. If there is conspiracy it should be flashed in public to show how bad these politicians are. Wikileaks does the job.

It is not mandatory to show every sort of info. to the public either it is a conspiracy between two countries this can spoil the mind of people bcuz as we all that all people r not in one queue so there can be clash between them so this can not be good for civilians.

5. Lets say you got a confidential information of others. and it says something destructive. Should you keep the information back in closed box?

There is a proper way to show a thing to flash something in front of people (If needed), if you show anything in front of people in a special way by which people get it in another way which is not correct of fake etc so how would people come to know the actual point whether they dont know it is 100% truth info. or not.

We are repeating on points. And yes we have discussed so many points in this debate, that is good! Still if you have questions on my points please ask.

1) Another good point about wikileaks is, it is increasing political awareness in civillians, which is very good thing. Some basic knowledge about diplomacy or political over view every civillian should have before casting a vote.

As we all know that to some extend casting a vote is in the hand of a civilian but if you know about this that actually people r not bringing any leader for running their country it is decided between few govts and it is just a so called voting by civilians or we can say casting votes by civilians is only a formality.

In Pakistan I believe that except of some (countable) political people NO BODY wanted to see zardari as a President of Pakistan but he became.... it's politics.

2) Wikileaks will help civillians to decide whom they should vote and whom not.

As I mentioned in previous point that it is just formality to get the votes casted by civilians, Actually it was already decided who will be the president etc.

When people will listen/see the (flashed) issue/info. about politcians by means of wikileaks people will start fighting cuz as u must know there is not an unity between allll civilians... if 30% people r in favor of "A", 30% r in favor of "B" and the rest 40% r in favor of "C" so they must me clash between these three (3) parties people...

Thank you.

 

[Don]

Netra you were failed to reply within 24 hours after Maan. For that reason, I m gonna have to close this debate, and make Maan the winner.
However, you can talk to maan and try to reopen this debate. If you want.

 

[Netraa]

Dear Maan, First of all i would like to thank you for requesting Don for reopening this thread. I am glad and fortunate to have you in this debate contest!

Now lets come to the debate points..

In first few points as you mentioned that Wikileaks news can be fake or not 100% truth. That is not correct. Because they are leaking the documents and cables and telegrams and conversions without making any edits on them. They are not doing pure journalism by cooking the original in newpaper way, but they are just publishing the truth in raw manner.

As you said they can publish the documents in proper manner, but there is no other way. As different countries have different laws and regulations which does not allow confidential information to be leaked, even if those information have any dangerous intension.

Next you said that, the votes from civillians does not matter, the winning political party is pre decided. I think it is not right. No matter it is pakistan or india, who ever wins definitely gets votes, may be to certain percentage it is manipulated to voting system that is called rigging. But if someone has won one election that does not mean that there is no one who has voted him!

But you are right on the fact that, in your or my country the bad ppl are easily winning. Even the decoits and criminals are getting political tickets and winning. It is because lack of political awareness and lack of education in people. I agree there are large number of it here. These people would vote even for few bucks 'blindly'. To correct this education is needed which is another topic! They dont even understand politics what they will understand about wikileaks.

 

[*Maan*]

Dear Maan, First of all i would like to thank you for requesting Don for reopening this thread. I am glad and fortunate to have you in this debate contest!

Netraa ur most welcome

Now lets come to the debate points..

In first few points as you mentioned that Wikileaks news can be fake or not 100% truth. That is not correct. Because they are leaking the documents and cables and telegrams and conversions without making any edits on them. They are not doing pure journalism by cooking the original in newpaper way, but they are just publishing the truth in raw manner.

As u r saying that they r publishing and leaking the documents and conversations without making any edit so this can not be correct because we really don’t know either they are editing or not and in fact we can’t come to know that they are 100% true. We don’t have any resource by which we can confirm their leaks or news.

As you said they can publish the documents in proper manner, but there is no other way. As different countries have different laws and regulations which does not allow confidential information to be leaked, even if those information have any dangerous intension.

If they spread any information regarding any political party so as u must know there are multiple political parties available in a country so there must be clash between them and no one can deny from this fact. If u believe I received a sms from one of my friend in which there was written that “tonight at about 1:45am wikileaks is going to flash/show something special by which people will be shocked” so Netraa wouldn’t be people crazy to listen that special news?? Off course they would be, thus if wikleaks has flashed any new thing in front of people obviously every viewer of that news would have got in his mind and have set fixed that something in his mind as per wikileaks wish.

Next you said that, the votes from civillians does not matter, the winning political party is pre decided. I think it is not right. No matter it is pakistan or india, who ever wins definitely gets votes, may be to certain percentage it is manipulated to voting system that is called rigging. But if someone has won one election that does not mean that there is no one who has voted him!

Yes the winner political leader does get votes but he wins by cheating and almost every body knows this they receive 100,000 votes but they show 1,000,000 votes in their favour therefore it is not in the hand of civilians. I personally know that plenty of people didn’t want Mr. Zardari to be a president of our Country but he became… so this is clear in front of everybody and a common man can not do anything special in this regard.

But you are right on the fact that, in your or my country the bad ppl are easily winning. Even the dacoits and criminals are getting political tickets and winning. It is because lack of political awareness and lack of education in people. I agree there are large number of it here. These people would vote even for few bucks 'blindly'. To correct this education is needed which is another topic! They dont even understand politics what they will understand about wikileaks.

I would like to inform you that there is a plenty of people who know many things about politics but knowing politics is not enough here bcuz knowingly they people can’t do anything against their leaders etc, the same situation is here to understand wikileaks people have to get what wikileaks wants them to get.

Thank You.

 

[Netraa]

1) Well the documents or cables wikileaks are publishing are raw documents. They even have stamps, government seals, diplomats voice and videos. Only because wikileaks are flashing truth thats why world is reacting to it like this, else who would care!

2) So how you want them to flash the documents. Should wikileaks come to all and ask - okay hold your heart as i am going to flash shocking news? Even news papers, TV channels dont do it. They just flash the news if it is true.

3) So you are saying civillians have no right to chose correct govt for their own country? I mean they are just dummy sleeping babies? If it is that then not only wiki leaks any political news will not impact them!

But i dont think it is true. Lets say you talking about Zardari. So he must have a political party? And all supports him? he must have ministers in his ministry, and they all will support? And every minister will represent some local area from where atleast some support will come. In such system its not possible to win election by doing manipulation in all the places. And for doing manipulation also u need people right? I think we are moving to different topic, we should not continue this point.

The bottom line is here we are talking about civillians who are in a democratic country where civillians have right to talk, decide and demand, not any autonomous or socialist country.

 

[*Maan*]

Well the documents or cables wikileaks are publishing are raw documents. They even have stamps, government seals, diplomats voice and videos. Only because wikileaks are flashing truth thats why world is reacting to it like this, else who would care!


I think u really don’t know about such things which are not 100% truth but people are reacting on that… I wanna give u example:
A soft drink company “Pepsi” gave an advertisement about their cold drink’s offer during the month of RAMADAN UL MUBARAK they declared that during RAMADAN UL MUBARAK Rs.5/- has been decreased on one soft drink bottle, it was really not a big news for people But u know what every body was sending mobile sms for this news (u can ask any body who lives here in Pakistan) there are some more examples available. So when people can react on such small things so obviously they will react on such news which comes from wikileaks no matter it is confirm or not but people have to take it as an effective news.

So how you want them to flash the documents. Should wikileaks come to all and ask - okay hold your heart as i am going to flash shocking news? Even news papers, TV channels dont do it. They just flash the news if it is true.

Oh they just flash the news if it is true… who knows that it is true???
Sometime ago in my city (Karachi) the circumstances was not good and target killings were going on, Tv channel flashed that in ABC area operation is going on against terrorists while NO OPERATION was going there, but those people who don’t come in that area OR who have no relative/friend/colleague living in that area they will surely accept this news but one of my office colleague told me actually this was not the truth.

So you are saying civillians have no right to chose correct govt for their own country? I mean they are just dummy sleeping babies? If it is that then not only wiki leaks any political news will not impact them!

They are not dummies they have rights to choose but u know what this is only so called rights because in Asian countries u already know cheating must be there in voting so what is the benefit of people’s votes…

But i dont think it is true. Lets say you talking about Zardari. So he must have a political party? And all supports him? he must have ministers in his ministry, and they all will support? And every minister will represent some local area from where atleast some support will come. In such system its not possible to win election by doing manipulation in all the places. And for doing manipulation also u need people right? I think we are moving to different topic, we should not continue this point.

Yes Mr. Zardari has a political party but 100% people do not like him, there are just few people like him just for the sake of benefits (money/positions/power). Political people (related to his party) support him but only for their own sake NOT FOR CIVILIANS. Yes the MNA (Member Of National Assembly) people are related to different local areas but it does not mean that the desire of common citizens (like us) will be completed. No doubt that votes of people contain value but not 100% u can assume people’s wish 30% and the rest 70% is the political game which has much depth and related to another topic.

The bottom line is here we are talking about civillians who are in a democratic country where civillians have right to talk, decide and demand, not any autonomous or socialist country.

If I consider Pakistan for ur above comment so I must say that civilians don’t have rights to decide to demand here… Yes in policies in documents in rules & regulations it is written that people have full rights to demand to decide etc but this is practical life here these are only words to say. U can confirm it by any Pakistani common person.
I would really like to share a thing with u here that… When a journalist goes in any shopping mall with his camera man to take some comments from civilians/people so 99.99% people complaint and it is 100% correct because we are included in that 99.99% people.

Thank You Netraa

 

[Princess Mahi]

haye Allah jee ye hain kia

 

[Netraa]

Your 1st few points are about people reacting wrongly! That can happen for any news. Cant blame Wikileaks.

Secondly, i said Wikileaks is leaking truth, thats why world is reacting so much, i meant not unaware people, but the knowledgeable peoples in politics, media and other top members of countries who reacts on genuine matters.

Your last points were about civillians having no right, -- which is a bigger problem than impact of wikileaks that needs to be solved first.

Thank God!!! today is Dec 16!! I hope this should my last post here.. Yeaaahh No more breaking head to post here {(dancing)}

I believe it has been a great job from both of us replying each other in alternative posts!!

Last point that Don mentioned is-- wikileaks is a good topic to newspapers, magazines, TV, internet and writers. So yeah, watch out to movies, you might soon see a blockbuster hitting big screens on Wikileaks . I think Tom Hanks or Johny Depp or Matt Damon would be good fit for role of owner of Wikileaks lol

Cheers! Goodbye.

 

[*Maan*]

Your 1st few points are about people reacting wrongly! That can happen for any news. Cant blame Wikileaks.

Secondly, i said Wikileaks is leaking truth, thats why world is reacting so much, i meant not unaware people, but the knowledgeable peoples in politics, media and other top members of countries who reacts on genuine matters.


Yeah they can be knowledgeable people but who knows what is truth actually.

Your last points were about civillians having no right, -- which is a bigger problem than impact of wikileaks that needs to be solved first.

Yeah here in Asia this has become a big problem which people have to face every time and they can’t change it.

Thank God!!! today is Dec 16!! I hope this should my last post here.. Yeaaahh No more breaking head to post here
I believe it has been a great job from both of us replying each other in alternative posts!!

Yup it was a good job Netraa

Last point that Don mentioned is-- wikileaks is a good topic to newspapers, magazines, TV, internet and writers. So yeah, watch out to movies, you might soon see a blockbuster hitting big screens on Wikileaks. I think Tom Hanks or Johny Depp or Matt Damon would be good fit for role of owner of Wikileaks lol

Cheers! Goodbye.

Hehe Take Good Care And Thanks

 

[Don]

This debate is now closed!!!
Will post result by Monday Inshallah !!!